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Post by paleone on Aug 24, 2005 8:35:01 GMT -5
listen. we are known by our fruits. DO a REAL study on the swine subject. i gave you TWO DIFFERENT commentaries on the swine comment. You are off a bit. If you truly know Christ then i pray that your eyes are opened to the love that we are called to give people.
I am a victim of a loved one being murdered. I am also a victim of assault. So you know, i have both sides of the pendelum. You know nothing of me. and you are by your actions no different than a pharisee. I have already given proof and scriptures. I also disproved your interpretations with commentaries from bible scholars. So enough of this. In fact, here i will put some lyrics to a song that shows that those who are workers in Christ will be hated for it. This is ministry. God uses me to love prisoners. And i have seen fruits of that labor. I don't need to prove a thing to you. I pray for you that your eyes will open.
They Hate You- by FBS step thru the doorway and read the writing on the wall they all laugh and mock you they are all hoping to watch you fall
-they hate you, but they hated me before -they hate you, but they hated me before -i called you out to be my child -and that is why they have turned their backs on you
they beat you, they stone you despise you because you bear my name but hold up your head child remember they treated me the same
another song:
Head Held High-FBS forsaken by his followers, forsaken by his friends still he bore the cross of shame a sacrifice for sin he stood alone, he took a fall so you and I could live and still he stands with outstretched hands everytime I slip
-but I keep my chin up, and my head held high -I don't look back cause thets when I fall behind -I don't do this to show you my pride -I do it for the lamb who was crucified
the time has come for each of us to pick a side and fight I will side with Jesus Christ the way the truth the light my life used to be empty like an oyster with no pearl but now I wanna dance like david danced I wanna tell the world
how about another?
Stand and be Counted- FBS Stand and be counted people in christ arise against a world that has been feeding you its lies if we are steadfast we've a hope that shall endure and if we stand in christ, you know we stand secure the fields are ripe for harvest, would you lend a hand for we are all called to be fishers of men onward christian soldiers march into the setting sun for even if I stand alone, I will keep marching on
-arm in arm we shall stand firm -against the powers of this world -blood bought, saved, and sanctified -but quickly running out of time
we need redemption not just another anthem our heart is all that he desires it is pathetic how we are so thick headed we need to fight fire with fire
I will love people. ALL people. I will stand firm in the love for all of God's children. Yes, the unloveable. I am not here for idle argument with a modern pharisee. God will do what He needs through me, and i will never stop in this call.
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Post by paleone on Aug 24, 2005 8:37:53 GMT -5
Stand and be counted is an amazing song. Take it to heart will ya?
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Post by truth1 on Aug 24, 2005 9:01:53 GMT -5
that's right...murder is above all sin that Jesus died on a cross for right? come on now... now tell me something...the OT needed the DP to atone for sin...if someone sinned against someone they were allowed the DP...but Jesus atoned for ALL of that...and we therefore have the ability to be "Saved" and be "washed clean"....why in the world would Jesus Die a murderer's death, atone for the sins of the world only to ask of us that we still atone for sin??? what you are in essance saying is a man may very well get saved while in prison, but must still pay the price because gosh darn it, God had the DP in the OT....sorry....don't happen that way...God does not ask for double atonement...atonement is done.... and once i am done with this, i will stop casting my pearls to swine, you obviously do not value life as God has asked us to....read the verses i have provided in my past posts and signature... I value the life of the good and innocent very much. You seem to constantly ignore or play down the reason Christ gave to not give pearls to pigs-because they are violent and will harm you. I've visited and written letters to people in prison for lesser crimes or political reasons. All these people should come before a cruel and heinous murderer like the abductor, rapist and murderer of 1 year old Amy Sue Seitz for example. This little girl was skinned alive by this evildoer. www.cybersleuths.com/billkelly/bkchap1.htmwww.wtv-zone.com/LadyMaggie/php/AmySueStory.htmlVisting such an evildoer as Amy's murderer in prison would mean bypassing all the prisoners worldwide who are more worthy of our caring. It would also build the cult status of those who choose evil. You make them significance, the focus of attention. This confirms their narcissism and lowers the deterrent effect of prison in the eyes of others capable of such horrible, sadistic murders. Christ said many things with few words. His parable of the vinyard was a message to the Pharisees, concerning the destruction of Israel, but his parables also contain social and judical commentaries and so much more that we're not aware of. Nowhere does Christ say that his death would mean outlawing capital punishment. In Luke 22: 36, etc. Christ, knowing he will be leaving this world physically, advises his followers to sell their cloaks to buy swords. They obviously weren't going to be slicing bread with these swords. There is evil in this world and evil must be held back or deterred. King Saul fell from God's grace because he refused to carry out a death sentence against a captive Moabite King. I believe this death sentence was meant to deter other tribal kings from harming God's people. That was the most horrific thing I have ever read. This piece of crap should be executed immediately. In fact, during his execution, he should only be injected with potassium chloride. That way his veins sear with indescribable pain. His last breath should be a scream. So much for the rehabilitation argument. This old piece of garbage needs to painfully die NOW.
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Post by ela on Aug 24, 2005 9:04:35 GMT -5
Truth??? Is it you? Hello? LOL I have never heard you talk this way.
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Post by CCADP on Aug 24, 2005 9:13:32 GMT -5
Of course when we hear a story like this we are blinded by rage and anger. Even for abolitionists - parents ourselves - something like this can make us pause. But Truth its not about rehabilitation. Like you have said in a recent post; its the punishment that we don't agree on - not because the guy doesn't perhaps deserve to be killed; but because we don't deserve to be killers.
Its not about how horrible the crime is. Even though children are our most innocent and vulnerable; and we are all enraged and mystified by acts against them; we cannot allow our rage to overide our self.
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Post by paleone on Aug 24, 2005 9:19:45 GMT -5
For me, it is part of what you said CCADP but it is also rehabilitation. The reason the DP is supposedly used is because they don't want them to be "further threat to society" and they use the fact of repeat offenders...rehabilitation is needed to deter the repeat offenses from happening. it's a cycle, and it will continue to go round and round until the issues are handled.
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Post by ela on Aug 24, 2005 9:26:07 GMT -5
To be honest, for my personal experience I have to say that sometimes, in some cases, it can be too late for rehabilitation; in those case society should provide places properly equipped to handle people who can not be rehabilitated. This is why I am a lot for PREVENTION. Things should be kept under control from the beginning... before it is just too late... And this is our responsibility.. as parents, as family members, as just citozens. This is how society should work
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Post by truth1 on Aug 24, 2005 9:26:58 GMT -5
Truth??? Is it you? Hello? LOL I have never heard you talk this way. I know it was a bit harsh, and I hope I didn't offend. But, I have to say that the story was very difficult to read . Knowing that he tortured Amy Sue and stating that the children will not have a good childhood is hard for me to take. Children are my weakness. I have a hard time controlling my feelings when a child is hurt. This was especially the case since the author went into graphic detail about the murder. Like I said, I know it was harsh, but, I am still a nice guy--see .
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Post by ela on Aug 24, 2005 9:28:14 GMT -5
I know truth! I know you and I know that you are a nice person...
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Post by truth1 on Aug 24, 2005 10:01:30 GMT -5
I know truth! I know you and I know that you are a nice person... Thank you.
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Post by truth1 on Aug 24, 2005 11:38:32 GMT -5
Here is more information. This was taken from online.ceb.com/calcases/C3/38C3d711.htm"An autopsy revealed that Amy had sustained a number of injuries prior to her death. As a result of pressure from a pliers-like instrument, her nipples had been pinched and partially pulled away from her body. She had suffered three blows to her head, knife-like scratches on her chest and abdomen, and ligature marks on her wrist and ankles. The entrance to her vagina was torn and the hymen broken, possibly by insertion of a penis; her anus exhibited evidence of trauma indicating that a foreign object had been inserted there as well. Sperm were discovered in her vaginal area. Her blood had a .03 percent blood alcohol level, which could result if a child of her size had ingested two cans of beer shortly before death. The actual cause of death was strangulation." "After his arrest, defendant became friendly with another inmate named James Smith. He spoke with Smith on numerous occasions, admitting that {Page 38 Cal.3d 721} he was a child molester. Defendant described his method of luring or coercing his preferred victims, "little girls between the ages of three and five", into his vehicle, driving them to remote locations, molesting them, then returning them to the place where he had picked them up. Defendant also told Smith he had seen Amy on several occasions while driving his wife to work, and had twice attempted to pick her up. Both attempts occurred approximately one week before Amy's death; both failed when other persons intervened. Nevertheless, defendant denied having committed the crimes against Amy, offering at various times three different alibis. Later, however, he asked Smith to find out for him about the defenses of diminished capacity and temporary insanity; when Smith asked defendant directly whether he was guilty, defendant did not deny it and replied only that "if he was to tell me that, ... it would be cutting his own throat." Defendant also talked frequently with an inmate named Donald Cummings. He told Cummings that he often drove around after dropping his wife off at work; he admitted spotting Amy "a couple of times" during such rides. When discussing why certain persons repeatedly committed the same crime, defendant said, "take for instance, a person like me ... I did this before, over and over, you get going doing something, your adrenalin builds up, the excitement is there." He added, however, that "this time, I got carried too far" and "things got out of hand." A third inmate testified that when asked how he could "do such a thing to a child," defendant replied, "I was with her that day, but they aren't going to know that."
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Post by sclcookie on Aug 24, 2005 12:22:25 GMT -5
That is horrible.
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Post by paleone on Aug 25, 2005 22:50:49 GMT -5
Maybe some people need to remember this too:
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Post by miles on Aug 26, 2005 3:16:31 GMT -5
As a believer in Christ, I SO wish He spoke in terms that were easy to interpret rather than the parables. These things are the cause for much confusion and I, for one thank Paleone for helping me understand them!
Miles
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Post by truth1 on Aug 26, 2005 7:45:04 GMT -5
Maybe some people need to remember this too: Maybe not.
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