Ross Autopsy Stirs Execution Debate

[janet]

Results of the autopsy done on serial killer Michael Ross are contributing to an international debate on whethr the condemned experience severe pain during the lethal injection process.

The results are being cited by several prominent doctors to reture a highly publicized article that appeared in The Lancet, the British medical journal in April - the month before Ross became the 1st convicted executed in New England in 45 years.

The article asserts that the level of anesthesia in many of the executed inmates studies by the authors appears to have been inadequate to prevent them from suffering severe pain as the caustic and lethal potassium chloride coursed through their veins before stopping their hearts.

Critics of the article, written by Dr. Leonidas G. Koniarus of the University of Miami's Miller School of Medicine and 3 others, say it does not account for postmorten redistribution of the anesthetic - thiopental. The redistribution, the critics say, accounts for the lower levels of thiopental on which Koniaris based his conclusions that the levels of anesthetic were inadequate. The Ross autopsy results document this redistribution, bolstering the critics' assertions.

Dr. H. Wayne Carver II, Conneticut's chief medical examiner, was aware of the controversial Lancet article before performing the Ross autopsy. As a result, he took the additional step of drawing a sample of Ross's blood 20 minutes aafter he was prounced dead at 2:25 a.m. May 13th. Carver took a subsequent sample during the autopsy, which began about 7 hours later, at 9:40 a.m.

The 1st sample showed a concentration of 29.6 milligrame per litre of thiopental; the second sample showed a concentration of 9.4 milligrams per litre. The 1st sample was drawn from Ross' right femoral artery, and the second from his heart, which can account for some of the discrepancy. But, Dr. Mark Heath, a new York anesthesiologist and one of the numerous doctors who have signed letters to The Lancet challenging the Koniaris article, said it clearly substantiates the postmorten redistribution of the thiopental.

... Dr. Jonathan Groner, a paediatric surgeon from Ohio and a leading critic of physician involvement in the execution process, is among the critics of The Lancet Article. He said he interviewed a number of forensic toxicologists before adopting the view that thiopental in a corpse leaves the blood and is absorbed by the fat, causing blood samples taken hours after death to be an unreliable marker of the levels of thiopental in the body at the time of death.

Groner described the Ross autopsy results as "a powerful refutation" of the Koniaris study.

... Most states use emergency medical technicians to carry out executions. Conneticut state regulations require that the execution team be trained to the satisfaction of a physicial overseeing that training. Coorection officials, to date, have refused to identify the physician involved in the Ross execution.

The Ross autopsy report indicates that several punctures were necessary to insert one of the intravenous lines, and that there was a bruise about 1 inch in diameter on Ross' right forearm. Carver concludes that the cause of death was "multiple drug toxicity" and list the manner of death as "homocide".

(source: Hartford Courant)

Some homocide! Is this really what pros want?

[novstorm]

My brother was an electrican and had an accident on the job. He lived and lost his hair and his skin was badly burnt. There is no way that the chair is a painless way to die. As for the lethal injection that too has to cause pain as it stops the heart and lungs. If you have ever had a heart attack you can suffer severe pain from it. Any way I believe that there is pain associated with either injection or electrocution.

[erick]

novstorm said:

My brother was an electrican and had an accident on the job. He lived and lost his hair and his skin was badly burnt. There is no way that the chair is a painless way to die. As for the lethal injection that too has to cause pain as it stops the heart and lungs. If you have ever had a heart attack you can suffer severe pain from it. Any way I believe that there is pain associated with either injection or electrocution.

I recommend reading this: www.dc.state.fl.us/oth/deathrow/drorder.html

Here is one scientific conclusion outlined in the link: Allen Lee Davis did not suffer any conscious pain while being electrocuted in Florida's electric chair. Rather, he suffered instantaneous and painless death once the current was applied to him

[laurauk]

ok, so can we stick you in the chair and stick god knows how many volts up your behind and then can you please report back to us and tell us all how good it felt????xxx

[Alyce]

High Five LauraUK!!!

[erick]

Why do people insist that the chair is painful? People assume that because it hurts to get zapped by a wall outlet, it must really hurt to die in the chair. This is akin to saying that because it hurts to get shot in the head with a BB gun, it must really hurt to get shot in the head by a .38. The current hits the condemned so fast that he is incapable of feeling anything.

[Alyce]

And you know this because......................??

[erick]

alyce said:

And you know this because......................??

Expert testimony:

Kris Sperry, M.D., Chief Medical Examiner for the Georgia Bureau of Investigation, testified for Respondents in the area of forensic pathology. Sperry was present as a witness during Kirschner's autopsy of Allen Lee Davis. Sperry opined that he application of ten amps of current to brain tissue causes instant depolarization and instant loss of consciousness. Sperry testified that an unconscious person cannot feel pain, and that death from irreversible brain damage occurs within seconds of the application of the current because the brain is heated well above a temperature from which it can recover. Sperry testified that seventy-five milliamps (75/1000 of an amp), externally applied to the body causes fibrillation of the heart. Sperry also testified that one amp of current applied externally to the body is sufficient to cause asystole, or complete stoppage of the heart. Sperry opined that after the heart is stopped, spontaneous heart movement may begin again, but the heart is irreversibly damaged and cannot recover. However, after the heart has stopped, agonal sounds and movement may still occur, as they are part of the last vestiges of life. Sperry also testified that an individual does not need to still be alive in order to bleed. Sperry testified that blood can drain from an individual for hours after the individual is dead.

Sperry further opined that the nose bleed suffered by Davis did not result from the placement of the strap across Davis' mouth, but that it occurred from some sort of increased pressure in Davis' upper torso or head region.

The deposition of William Hamilton, M.D., Medical Examiner for the Eighth Judicial Circuit, was read into the record due to Hamilton's unavailability. Hamilton was accepted as an expert testifying on behalf of Respondents in the field of pathology. Hamilton testified that he performed an autopsy on Allen Lee Davis. Hamilton testified that Davis had burns on his scalp and forehead, on his superpubic and right upper medial thigh region, and behind the right knee. Hamilton testified that he has performed autopsies on approximately thirty death row inmates who have been executed in Florida's electric chair. He stated that the burns on the heads and legs of the inmates executed within the last five or six years have been smaller than those that were observed on inmates who were executed years ago. Hamilton testified that these burns are post-mortem burns.

Hamilton testified that upon his examination of Davis, he observed that there was blood in Davis' naval cavity, but that he did not dissect the paranasal sinuses to find the cause. Hamilton testified that it appeared to be an ordinary nosebleed, and that if the electrical current had not been applied to Davis at that time, he would not have had the nose bleed.

Hamilton further testified that in his opinion, the delivery of ten amps to the human body with the path of the current being from the head to the leg results in immediate death, immediate loss of consciousness, immediate massive depolarization of the nervous system, and a rapid rise in the temperature of the internal tissues in the path of the current. He opined that the path of current would be from the top of the head through the brain and brain stem, through the center of the body, and then exiting through the electrode on the leg. Dr. Hamilton opined that immediate death would also result if the current were only four amps.

B.J. Wilder, M.D., Professor Emeritus at the University of Florida in neurology and neuroscience, testified on behalf of Respondents in the areas of neurology and neurophysiology. Wilder testified that during electroconvulsive therapy, in which the brain is stimulated with electricity to produce a controlled convulsion, two hundred and fifty to three hundred milliamps, or 250/1000 to 300/1000 of one amp, is used. Wilder testified that electrical currents of this level cause the patient to lose consciousness, and that upon regaining consciousness, the patient does not report pain. Wilder opined that the introduction of ten amps of electrical current by the means of a head-to-leg electrode, with one thousand five hundred volts would cause the individual to lose consciousness within a matter of milliseconds. Further, Wilder opined that the administration of one thousand five hundred (1,500) volts at ten (10) amps for eight seconds, followed by seven hundred (700) volts at four and one half (4½) amps for twenty-two seconds, followed by one thousand five hundred (1,500) volts at ten (10) amps for four seconds would cause a massive depolarization of every cell in the cerebral cortex, and would in probability cause a depolarization of cells in deep brain structures, such as the brain stem and the thalamus. Wilder further opined that the damage caused by such a massive current would be of such a magnitude that the brain cells would not recover. Wilder stated that an inmate would not perceive pain, fear, or anger once such a current is turned on. Wilder further testified that the brain dies before the body does, and spontaneous movements seen after electrocution in the electric chair are agonal.

[sclcookie]

erick said:

Why do people insist that the chair is painful? People assume that because it hurts to get zapped by a wall outlet, it must really hurt to die in the chair. This is akin to saying that because it hurts to get shot in the head with a BB gun, it must really hurt to get shot in the head by a .38. The current hits the condemned so fast that he is incapable of feeling anything.

I've seen pictures of my boyfriend after he was shot 5 times in the head. He had a painful look on his face. I imagine he went through a painful death.

[erick]

sclcookie said:

erick said:

Why do people insist that the chair is painful? People assume that because it hurts to get zapped by a wall outlet, it must really hurt to die in the chair. This is akin to saying that because it hurts to get shot in the head with a BB gun, it must really hurt to get shot in the head by a .38. The current hits the condemned so fast that he is incapable of feeling anything.

I've seen pictures of my boyfriend after he was shot 5 times in the head. He had a painful look on his face. I imagine he went through a painful death.

I really do not want to get into a discussion about the horrible murder of your boyfriend. I feel so bad that he was murdered, and I do not feel that it is right for me to say that he did not experiance pain. All I will say is that if I had to choose a method for my own death, it would be a bullet to the back of my head.

[paleone]

erick said:

Why do people insist that the chair is painful? People assume that because it hurts to get zapped by a wall outlet, it must really hurt to die in the chair. This is akin to saying that because it hurts to get shot in the head with a BB gun, it must really hurt to get shot in the head by a .38. The current hits the condemned so fast that he is incapable of feeling anything.

*edited, i was being too bitchy*

the point i attempted to make was that it is far from painless, there have been a lot of botched executions...these are the chair ones, but there are more than just this:

August 10, 1982. Virginia. Frank J. Coppola. Electrocution. Although no media representatives witnessed the execution and no details were ever released by the Virginia Department of Corrections, an attorney who was present later stated that it took two 55-second jolts of electricity to kill Coppola. The second jolt produced the odor and sizzling sound of burning flesh, and Coppola's head and leg caught on fire. Smoke filled the death chamber from floor to ceiling with a smokey haze.1

April 22, 1983. Alabama. John Evans. Electrocution. After the first jolt of electricity, sparks and flames erupted from the electrode attached to Evans's leg. The electrode burst from the strap holding it in place and caught on fire. Smoke and sparks also came out from under the hood in the vicinity of Evans's left temple. Two physicians entered the chamber and found a heartbeat. The electrode was reattached to his leg, and another jolt of electricity was applied. This resulted in more smoke and burning flesh. Again the doctors found a heartbeat. Ignoring the pleas of Evans's lawyer, a third jolt of electricity was applied. The execution took 14 minutes and left Evans's body charred and smoldering.

December 12, 1984. Georgia. Alpha Otis Stephens. Electrocution. "The first charge of electricity ... failed to kill him, and he struggled to breathe for eight minutes before a second charge carried out his death sentence ..."5 After the first two minute power surge, there was a six minute pause so his body could cool before physicians could examine him (and declare that another jolt was needed). During that six-minute interval, Stephens took 23 breaths. A Georgia prison official said, "Stephens was just not a conductor" of electricity.6

October 16, 1985. Indiana. William E. Vandiver. Electrocution. After the first administration of 2,300 volts, Vandiver was still breathing. The execution eventually took 17 minutes and five jolts of electricity.8 Vandiver's attorney, Herbert Shaps, witnessed the execution and observed smoke and the smell of burning. He called the execution "outrageous." The Department of Corrections admitted the execution "did not go according to plan."9

July 14, 1989. Alabama. Horace Franklin Dunkins, Jr. Electrocution. It took two jolts of electricity, nine minutes apart, to complete the execution. After the first jolt failed to kill the prisoner (who was mildly retarded), the captain of the prison guard opened the door to the witness room and stated "I believe we've got the jacks on wrong."15 Because the cables had been connected improperly, it was impossible to dispense sufficient current to cause death. The cables were reconnected before a second jolt was administered. Death was pronounced 19 minutes after the first electric charge. At a post-execution news conference, Alabama Prison Commissioner Morris Thigpen said, "I regret very very much what happened. [The cause] was human error."16

May 4, 1990. Florida. Jesse Joseph Tafero. Electrocution. During the execution, six-inch flames erupted from Tafero's head, and three jolts of power were required to stop his breathing. State officials claimed that the botched execution was caused by "inadvertent human error" -- the inappropriate substitution of a synthetic sponge for a natural sponge that had been used in previous executions.17 They attempted to support this theory by sticking a part of a synthetic sponge into a "common household toaster" and observing that it smoldered and caught fire

[truth1]

janet said:

Results of the autopsy done on serial killer Michael Ross are contributing to an international debate on whethr the condemned experience severe pain during the lethal injection process.

The results are being cited by several prominent doctors to reture a highly publicized article that appeared in The Lancet, the British medical journal in April - the month before Ross became the 1st convicted executed in New England in 45 years.

The article asserts that the level of anesthesia in many of the executed inmates studies by the authors appears to have been inadequate to prevent them from suffering severe pain as the caustic and lethal potassium chloride coursed through their veins before stopping their hearts.

Critics of the article, written by Dr. Leonidas G. Koniarus of the University of Miami's Miller School of Medicine and 3 others, say it does not account for postmorten redistribution of the anesthetic - thiopental. The redistribution, the critics say, accounts for the lower levels of thiopental on which Koniaris based his conclusions that the levels of anesthetic were inadequate. The Ross autopsy results document this redistribution, bolstering the critics' assertions.

Dr. H. Wayne Carver II, Conneticut's chief medical examiner, was aware of the controversial Lancet article before performing the Ross autopsy. As a result, he took the additional step of drawing a sample of Ross's blood 20 minutes aafter he was prounced dead at 2:25 a.m. May 13th. Carver took a subsequent sample during the autopsy, which began about 7 hours later, at 9:40 a.m.

The 1st sample showed a concentration of 29.6 milligrame per litre of thiopental; the second sample showed a concentration of 9.4 milligrams per litre. The 1st sample was drawn from Ross' right femoral artery, and the second from his heart, which can account for some of the discrepancy. But, Dr. Mark Heath, a new York anesthesiologist and one of the numerous doctors who have signed letters to The Lancet challenging the Koniaris article, said it clearly substantiates the postmorten redistribution of the thiopental.

... Dr. Jonathan Groner, a paediatric surgeon from Ohio and a leading critic of physician involvement in the execution process, is among the critics of The Lancet Article. He said he interviewed a number of forensic toxicologists before adopting the view that thiopental in a corpse leaves the blood and is absorbed by the fat, causing blood samples taken hours after death to be an unreliable marker of the levels of thiopental in the body at the time of death.

Groner described the Ross autopsy results as "a powerful refutation" of the Koniaris study.

... Most states use emergency medical technicians to carry out executions. Conneticut state regulations require that the execution team be trained to the satisfaction of a physicial overseeing that training. Coorection officials, to date, have refused to identify the physician involved in the Ross execution.

The Ross autopsy report indicates that several punctures were necessary to insert one of the intravenous lines, and that there was a bruise about 1 inch in diameter on Ross' right forearm. Carver concludes that the cause of death was "multiple drug toxicity" and list the manner of death as "homocide".

(source: Hartford Courant)

Some homocide! Is this really what pros want?

This article is basically saying that the levels of thiopental in the blood cannot be accurately measured. This does nothing to support the argument that the condemned suffer during lethal injection. By the way, homicide is simply the killing of one person by another. So, of course, executions could be considered homicide.

[truth1]

novstorm said:

My brother was an electrican and had an accident on the job. He lived and lost his hair and his skin was badly burnt. There is no way that the chair is a painless way to die. As for the lethal injection that too has to cause pain as it stops the heart and lungs. If you have ever had a heart attack you can suffer severe pain from it. Any way I believe that there is pain associated with either injection or electrocution.

The amount of thiopental injected is lethal. It would be rare, if not impossible, for a person to remain conscious after administration. I believe there is little to no pain involved.

[truth1]

laurauk said:

ok, so can we stick you in the chair and stick god knows how many volts up your behind and then can you please report back to us and tell us all how good it felt????xxx

The volts do not kill--it is the current. Why do you think people survive jolts from a stun gun with 500,000 volts? The current, measured in amperes, is what kills. One amp can kill a person. For those who care, one amp is equal to the flow of one coulomb per second. An average bolt of lightning can transfer a charge between 5 and 300 coulombs.

[janet]

Truth, the phamaceuticals used in a lethal injection are no longer utilized in euthanasia in the veterinarian profession.

Electrocution ... unthinkable and barbaric.