Deb
Settlin' In
~If you regret anything in life, don't regret not spending enough time with your children~
Posts: 42
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Post by Deb on Jul 21, 2005 16:19:20 GMT -5
I just want to start this by saying I did read all of Rich's from DR letters. Sometimes I was very impressed by him and sometimes not. I also read as much about his case as I could find without having access to public records etc. I did really feel that at the very least in light of the statement from Overstreet that his testimony was false that Rich should have received a stay until that could all be investigated further. I will also say that if in fact Rich did not do the actually shooting of Nick that no, he should not have been given the death penalty. Regardless of being a part of a group that that committed a crime with the end result of Mr. Moraida being killed, there still needs to be absolute proof of who was responsible for pulling the trigger. If I remember correctly, the gun was never found, therefore no fingerprints available, unless there was a witness outside of the three involved, or Rich was found to have the gun powder residue on his hands I don't see how absolute proof was given to warrant this man being sentenced to death. With that said, since his execution I've read a couple of articles that has me second guessing my feelings on his possible innocence. Below are the parts that I'm talking about. and Can you please explain to me why if in fact that is what his attorneys argued, why did they say that if he did not shoot Mr. Moraida? Also, what did he say in those letter he sent out before his trial that was so incriminating? Please don't take this as me trying to fight/debate with you about this, I'm just trying to find an explanation for the two things I'm questioning. Information is all I'm looking for.
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Post by Alyce on Jul 21, 2005 16:31:34 GMT -5
The first questions is WHERE ARE THE IMCRIMINATING letters that THEY SAY were writtin by Rcih (RIP) .......I myself DON NOT think these letters exist.....But I have seen the letter written by Overstreet to his girlfriend that states......"I was on drug.....and......I have always HATED FAGS....but I didn't mean to kill the little QUEEEN" I know someday the state of TEXAS will know that..Richard Cartwright was executed for a crime he DID NOT commit"" Bless You Rich!! Bless All!
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Post by sclcookie on Jul 21, 2005 20:49:58 GMT -5
I just want to start this by saying I did read all of Rich's from DR letters. Sometimes I was very impressed by him and sometimes not. I also read as much about his case as I could find without having access to public records etc. I did really feel that at the very least in light of the statement from Overstreet that his testimony was false that Rich should have received a stay until that could all be investigated further. I will also say that if in fact Rich did not do the actually shooting of Nick that no, he should not have been given the death penalty. Regardless of being a part of a group that that committed a crime with the end result of Mr. Moraida being killed, there still needs to be absolute proof of who was responsible for pulling the trigger. If I remember correctly, the gun was never found, therefore no fingerprints available, unless there was a witness outside of the three involved, or Rich was found to have the gun powder residue on his hands I don't see how absolute proof was given to warrant this man being sentenced to death. With that said, since his execution I've read a couple of articles that has me second guessing my feelings on his possible innocence. Below are the parts that I'm talking about. and Can you please explain to me why if in fact that is what his attorneys argued, why did they say that if he did not shoot Mr. Moraida? Also, what did he say in those letter he sent out before his trial that was so incriminating? Please don't take this as me trying to fight/debate with you about this, I'm just trying to find an explanation for the two things I'm questioning. Information is all I'm looking for. I'm assuming you seen my post to Tina Church requesting her not to post the Documents she has. The reason being is thing that are posted online about Rich's case are being turned around and I don't want other information out here on the net to be turned around. First I have to say so what about what the Texas Board of Pardons and Paroles voted? I kind of expected that. Rich expected that. First of all, he's been writing the Uncensored articles that TDCJ reads.....kinda strange how fast he got a date after he started writing said articles. Don't get me wrong, he expected a date prior to writing the articles, however, not as soon as he received a date. Also, Overstreet changed his story (you'll find the article online). He did continued saying Rich was the Shooter, however, he (Overstreet) said that he (Overstreet) was the leader. So, that's about all the Courts had to go on with his appeals. Plus, if you look for Tina Churche's posts, you'll find a bit of other information of why they couldn't help Rich this late. His attorneys? Well, see, the paper doesn't say which attorneys? Rich had different attorneys with his appeals. Ask yourself why would his attorneys that were trying to help with his appeals make such a statement prior to the Supreme Court? Not everyone who reads the paper thinks about that. Don't you think they could get in trouble for making such a statement about their client? Attorneys are supposed to represent their client to the best of their ability and such statements to the paper would hinder their case. Also, I'm going to share an e mail with you that I received from the KRIS reporter (I have it posted elsewhere so it's not new information). "From: "Bart Bedsole" <bbedsole@kristv.com> To: inmates@1prison.com Date: 13 May 2005, 02:45:20 PM Subject: Re: Richard Cartwright In our story, his private investigator explains how they believe Kelly Overstreet was the one that actually killed him, then put the gun in Richard Cartwright's hands. Sorry if that seems unclear. No, we didn't "bother" going to Livingston to interview Richard directly, because we were told several weeks ago by his family that Richard's attorney felt that was not a good idea. We tried, but were denied. I'm still not sure why. Bart Bedsole KRIS 6 News" See, the newspapers don't give you the entire story. And the Caller-Times printed something about Rich refusing an interview with them. What they neglected to say was that interview request was prior to Rich recieving a date. The truth is we requested media attn. from all over the State of Texas and the US. When I sent my letter to the Texas Board of Pardons and Parole, I also sent copies to the media, which wasn't hidden being that I placed the names and addresses in the bottom of my letter under "cc:" the proper area of my letter. As far as Rich not receiving a 30 day stay, that's one good thing I have to say about the Governor. Rich did not want a 30 day stay. He didn't want his family and friends to go through the sh*t we went through at the time of his execution twice. hugggz, Suzanne
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Post by rain on Jul 22, 2005 9:07:22 GMT -5
Richard was a wonderful person who meant a lot to a lot of people. I am still curious about these questions Deb asked. (In NO disrespect). I believe that when these questions are cleared up... People will believe his innocense..
1. In an appeal to the courts this week, Cartwright's lawyers argued he shot Moraida under pressure from one of his companions and jurors who determined Cartwright should die never were aware of that duress.
DID HE SHOOT MR. MORAIDA UNDER DURESS??
2. Just before his trial, Cartwright wrote letters from jail to his partners urging them to all agree on a single story. The letters were intercepted by authorities. "They were very incriminating," Skurka said. "That helped hang him. We had the co-defendants, the accomplices, and we had to have corroborating testimony, and he provided it."
ARE THESE LETTERS REAL?? THEY HAVE TO BE IN TRIAL TRANSCRIPTS, CORRECT??
These are the questions going through peoples heads that doubt him. I myself DO NOT want to doubt him. But these two questions.............
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Post by sclcookie on Jul 22, 2005 9:23:42 GMT -5
Actually, Alyce answered those questions. I have yet to see those letters and what the newspapers printed of what the letters said didn't prove anything incriminating.
Well, let me ask you something also, if you had a gun and your aquantence didn't have a gun, would they be able to make you shoot someone? You know, I'm not going to try to convince you.
As far as any new information goes, I'm not posting anymore. I asked Tina not to post transcripts. Rich is dead. We're not trying to save his life anymore. His name will be cleared. Unless you are someone high up in the courts, I don't think you'll have any influence over that. There is enough information public.
I'm sorry if you doubt Rich's innocense. That's something you'll have to work through on your own.
There is plenty of information online for people to doubt his guilt, therefore, showing any new information isn't necessary.
If you google Cartwright 999224 you'll probably find whatever information is out there that you're looking for.
I had an advantage and met Rich in person....we didn't just know each other through letters, we know each other through our visits. I wish all of y'all would have been able to get to know him on the level I did. I'm sorry, that won't happen now.
hugggz, Suzanne
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Post by rain on Jul 22, 2005 9:38:59 GMT -5
Thank you for your answers. I'm sorry the doubt is there too. I wish there was no doubt at all. That's why Richard's case is soooo emotional. I cannot believe they found a jury to convict him off of the info I have read (and I HAVE googled ALOT). Thanks Suzanne, I know its hard for you and everyone. It sure would not change the way I feel about him anyway I guess. He was a wonderful person, you ARE lucky you had the pleasure of knowing him.
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Post by sclcookie on Jul 22, 2005 9:43:08 GMT -5
I've got a link for you....look at the things said about his lawyer "strategically" not objecting to things. That'll give you an idea what kind of representation he had: www.clarkprosecutor.org/html/death/US/cartwright969.htmOne thing you might think about is if jurors we're always correct in the verdicts, why would we have an appeal process in the first place? Why not bypass all that BS? hugggz, Suzanne
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Post by sclcookie on Jul 22, 2005 9:47:09 GMT -5
You know, if he did shoot Nick, I still would think highly of him. But he didn't shoot Nick.
I write a few inmates who are guilty in their convictions (of course I won't volunteer who they are), however, I still respect them for their honesty.
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Post by Alyce on Jul 22, 2005 11:14:48 GMT -5
Suzanne....Your gonna drive yourself into a hole if you keep answering everybody questions!! All that matters is that YOU...Yourself know the answers!! Someday EVERYONE will know the TRUTH that Rich was innocent. And I know that day will come! So to anyone who has questions do the research yourself believe me when you finish investigating you in your heart will know **Richard Cartwright was executed for a crime he DID NOT commit***!! Bless All! PS. Suzanne....remember you have nothing to prove the truth will prevail!!
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Post by truth1 on Jul 22, 2005 11:53:09 GMT -5
Richard was a wonderful person who meant a lot to a lot of people. I am still curious about these questions Deb asked. (In NO disrespect). I believe that when these questions are cleared up... People will believe his innocense.. 1. In an appeal to the courts this week, Cartwright's lawyers argued he shot Moraida under pressure from one of his companions and jurors who determined Cartwright should die never were aware of that duress. DID HE SHOOT MR. MORAIDA UNDER DURESS?? 2. Just before his trial, Cartwright wrote letters from jail to his partners urging them to all agree on a single story. The letters were intercepted by authorities. "They were very incriminating," Skurka said. "That helped hang him. We had the co-defendants, the accomplices, and we had to have corroborating testimony, and he provided it." ARE THESE LETTERS REAL?? THEY HAVE TO BE IN TRIAL TRANSCRIPTS, CORRECT?? These are the questions going through peoples heads that doubt him. I myself DO NOT want to doubt him. But these two questions............. I am sure the letter exists. They cannot tell the court about the letter without producing it. That does not fly. Even the most moronic defense attorney would ask to see the letter.
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Post by paleone on Jul 22, 2005 12:09:30 GMT -5
I am sure the letter exists. They cannot tell the court about the letter without producing it. That does not fly. Even the most moronic defense attorney would ask to see the letter. don't be so sure of that...have you been to texas? not all are the sharpest tools in the shed...i am assuming you are not familiar with the way lawyers are in texas..(not all of course)...but, there was even a case where someone's lawyer slept through part of the trial..it's been makign news (suzanne, you know i am not referring to EVERYONE...don't get mad at me *grin*)
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Deb
Settlin' In
~If you regret anything in life, don't regret not spending enough time with your children~
Posts: 42
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Post by Deb on Jul 24, 2005 14:21:23 GMT -5
I haven't been able to find them either, other then exerpts, but in that link for the Clark prosecutor that sclcookie provided, it does state in there that the prosecution introduced the letters during the trial.
In that article, Rich's attorney says he felt those are what hurt him the most. So, from that I have to conclude that they do exist. Still my question remains, not if they exist, but what did they actually say. I guess I'll just keep searching, looking for transcripts or evidence introduced in his trial.
No, I did not see that post. I've been trying to look around for it but haven't been able to find it yet, if you know what thread its under can you point me in that direction so I could take a look at it?
I didn't know this either, haven't yet been able to find an article saying that Overstreet changed his story again. I'll keep looking, also I'll look through Tina's posts and see what more I could learn.
What you posted is exactly why I asked the question, did the attorney's really say this and why would they say it if it were not true? If they did not have Rich's best interest in hand, why were they representing him at that appeal? That too I guess I will just have to keep searching on my own.
I don't really understand that thinking, and the reason I say that is this. If I have a loved one that was terminally ill, not physically in pain and has his right mind but were told he would only last to the end of the week and somehow he lasted another 30 days. I would feel blessed that I had that loved one another 30 days. Obviously the situation I give is different because Rich was in prison so you don't "really" have them another 30 days. But was it so hopeless that during that 30 days there was no possibility of prolonging the stay and possibly finding a way to get his sentence changed to life? If the answer is emphatically no, then I guess I do understand why he just felt if it's going to happen it might as well happen now. I hope I explained my thoughts well enough that you understand what I was trying to say. Maybe I can try to explain my thoughts a little further.
I feel that comparing having a loved one on DR is comparable to having a loved one terminally ill with lung cancer caused specifically from smoking, or Cirrhosis of the liver due to their excessive alcohol abuse .
In either situation they are in this position of losing their life due to specific actions they chose in their life. It is not fair at all to the family and friends who will be left to deal with the grief of losing them and preparing yourself as their time nears. We all wish there was a way to turn back time and do things differently, but unfortunately that is not possible.
Ok, back to the topic of the thread...
I'm kinda confused by this post, I don't understand why Suzanne would be digging herself in a hole but putting the truth out there for people. And the thing is I have been searching since a couple months before Rich's execution trying to learn more about his case.
I would just like to explain why I started this thread in the first place. I don't expect you to have read my intro post to this board but in it I explained that although a pro I am trying to become involved in helping those who do not belong on death row. Rich's was a case that I felt may be one that I could support and use as an example to voice my support to those that don't. I was conflicted on my support after his execution when I read those articles that I mentioned in my first post to this thread. I have not been able to find through searching anything that gives me answers to my questions. Knowing how many people on here were friends with Rich I felt many of you would have those answers. I didn't want to bring it up soon after his death, but felt maybe now would be alright to broach the subject.
Apparently, I was wrong, so I will thank you for your responses and leave this subject alone.
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Post by sclcookie on Jul 24, 2005 15:14:21 GMT -5
ccadp.proboards40.com/index.cgi?board=debate&action=display&thread=1119306979Deb, you'll find some of tina's posts in the above. www.deathrow.at/rmc/A copy of overstreets original letter is in the above link. www.kristv.com/Global/story.asp?S=3369939Above is a news article that has a bit about Overstreet changing his story. www.kristv.com/Global/story.asp?S=3339804above is an article on Rich prior to his execution and the following is an e mail I received in response to an e mail I sent to reporter about said story: In our story, his private investigator explains how they believe Kelly Overstreet was the one that actually killed him, then put the gun in Richard Cartwright's hands. Sorry if that seems unclear. No, we didn't "bother" going to Livingston to interview Richard directly, because we were told several weeks ago by his family that Richard's attorney felt that was not a good idea. We tried, but were denied. I'm still not sure why. Bart Bedsole KRIS 6 News Any new things about Rich's case, I'd rather not have up online. Tina has the transcripts. I asked her not to post them. It's not necessary. We're not trying to save Rich's life. There is enough information online for people to question the State of Texas executing an innocent man. As far as Rich not receiving a 30 day stay. Thank goodness. I miss him severely. Going through what we went through prior to his execution was hell. We fought so hard to get the media's attention, to get the Clemency Board's attn. It's very emotionally draining to spend so much time each day trying to help someone, and feel helpless at the same time. I spent all my free hours trying to help him. I know Irene spent more than that trying to help her son. God Bless her. I couldn't imagine what Irene and Diane went through. I know it had to be 10 times worse, him being Irene's son and Diane's brother. What Alyce is referring to is I'm having to defend Rich with the same info. It gets tiresome however I will not let my dear friend and brother down. I will defend him for the rest of my life. No one will ever stop me from defending him. If you read Rich's Uncensored Articles, you know how much we meant to each other. I was his voice and I will always be. Deb, I'm sorry, I can't give you anymore information than what's online. If you still doubt his innocence, well.....there's nothing I can do about that. Rich was a good man, an honest man. If you read the Uncensoreds, then you know him very well. He was so much himself in his articles. Many people got to know him very well. 99% of the people who read his articles who've commented on them don't doubt his innocent. Only about 1% do doubt. So I think Rich and I did very well. hugggz, Suzanne Here's a small example of what Rich meant to the 99% of the people who commented on Rich's articles: www.1prison.com/rcunspecial.html
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Post by kmlchitown on Jul 25, 2005 4:53:27 GMT -5
suzanne , your a rock star you and Rich did an awesome job and believe me you both still do an amazing job what a team .
I'm proud to know both of you
hugs
Karen
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Post by sclcookie on Jul 25, 2005 10:08:31 GMT -5
Karen! Ms. Thunder from Down Under! You're a rock star! You know, the more people argue Rich's case, the more I see how scared they are that his name will be cleared! And Tina's got his legals and it eats 'em up that she won't post them. . Way to go Tina! hugggz, Suzanne
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